------------------------------ Content-Type: text/plain blake-d Digest Volume 1996 : Issue 62 Today's Topics: "The Voice of the Ancient Bard" DEAD MAN Reviewed Sympathetically RE: Preferably chew-proof Re: Muddle & Puzzle RE: Preferably Chewproof "The Voice of the Ancient Bard" -Reply Re: discipleship of Blakeans: US vs. UK -Reply/ esp. JESUS Preferably chew-proof -Reply Jah Wobble and Blake To J. Michaels and All Interested Re: Blake "sight" Re: "The Voice of the Ancient Bard" Tainted Visions on Friedlander Re: Blake "sight" RADICAL EXPRESSION -- QUERY [Fwd: The grave of William Blake] Re: Tainted Visions on Friedlander Re: Blake "sight" Re: Muddle & Puzzle retrospective blake sighting Questioning Idiots Re: Questioning Idiots ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 15:15:13 -0500 From: jmichael@seraph1.sewanee.edu (J. Michael) To: blake@albion.com Subject: "The Voice of the Ancient Bard" Message-Id: <9605302020.AA09653@uu6.psi.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >In the last poem of _Songs of Experience_, when he says "clouds of reason >are gone" you get a sense of what side he tends to prefer. He's >ANTI-RATIONALIST. Randall, you seem to refer to this poem a lot, and I just want to point out that it was not always "the last poem of _SE_." Blake varied the order of the _Songs_ so greatly that there is no definitive order, regardless of what you may see in commercial editions. Erdman says this poem, "The Voice of the Ancient Bard," "began among _Songs of Innocence_; was shifted to _Songs of Experience_ in some early copies yet appears occasionally in _Innocence_ in copies as late as 1818." (E 800) I personally don't like the poem and consequently don't pay much attention to it (like you with the Prophecies, I guess). In the first place, I don't hear it as Blake speaking. Any time someone says "youth, come hither," as in the Nurse's Songs, they're usually trying to impose on youth. And the "image of truth new born" doesn't really manifest itself in the poem: it only looks backward at the "maze of folly" in which the "youth of delight" still are stumbling. In other words, it's an example of "artful teazing" itself, and to me that justifies Blake's moving it from Innocence to Experience. In a larger sense, though, I think it's wrong to read the _Songs_ as a sequential narrative or a journey that we "go through," not only because the sequence is impossible to establish, but also because the "two contrary states" are constantly pressing on each other. Do you read "The Tyger" right after "The Lamb," or do you wait until you've read all the _Songs of Innocence_? What about the other paired poems--Chimney Sweeper, Holy Thursday, etc.? In short, I don't think there is a "conclusion" to the _Songs_, as there is to _MHH_. >But to see no one in this group, in 1996, coming to AT LEAST the conclusion >of "So what if he was!" is a case of historical whitewashing. > >-R.H. Albright Yes, so what if he was? Most people here probably resist the charge of madness against Blake because in the past it was used to dismiss his work. And Friedlander, in the conclusion you quoted, rejected Blake's ideas as "wrong" and "sick." By the way, I can't find the passages you quoted as being from the conclusion of _Milton_, but I did find this: To cast aside from Poetry, all that is not Inspiration That it no longer shall dare to mock with the aspersion of Maness Cast on the Inspired, by the tame high finisher of paltry Blots, Indefinite, or paltry Rhymes, or paltry Harmonies. (41.7-10) If, in the end, "mad" and "inspired" come to mean the same thing, what's the point? Blake may have been mad, but not everyone who is mentally ill can produce what he produced. I've said enough (or Too much!) Jennifer MIchael ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 15:28:39 -0400 From: albright@world.std.com (R.H. Albright) To: blake@albion.com Subject: DEAD MAN Reviewed Sympathetically Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Nelson Hilton: Thanks for passing on that very sympathetic review of DEAD MAN. Wasn't the Neil Young soundtrack perfect? And... I don't want to talk too much about it for those who haven't seen it yet... -R.H. Albright ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 15:46:41 -0500 (CDT) From: RPYODER@ualr.edu To: blake@albion.com Subject: RE: Preferably chew-proof Message-Id: <960530154641.602a728f@ualr.edu> Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT You might try _A Visit to William Blake's Inn: Poems for Innocent and Experienced Travelers_," by Nancy Willard, illustrated by Alice and Martin Provensen, 1981, HBJ, isbn 0-15-293823-0. Walden Books or someplace comparable will have it. Here's a sample: This inn belongs to William Blake and many are the beasts he's tamed and many are the stars he's named and many those who stop and take their joyful rest with William Blake. Two mighty dragons brew and bake and many are the loaves they've burned and many are the spits they've turned and many those who stop and break their joyful bread with William Blake. Two patient angels wash and shake his featherbeds, and far away snow falls like feathers. That's the day good children run outside and make snowmen to honor William Blake. Paul Yoder ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 18:10:14 -0400 From: albright@world.std.com (R.H. Albright) To: blake@albion.com Subject: Re: Muddle & Puzzle Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >For a fine understanding of muddle and Blake, see Gregory Bateson's _Ecology >of Mind_. There is a chapter on Why Are Things Muddled and then a later >chapter called Why Do Things Have Outlines which links the muddle problem with >Blake and his stance(s) on clear bounding lines. Thank you, Ron. A very good tip, indeed. Outside of official Blake scholarship, yet referring to Blake. Bateson is also the one who talks about "double binds" which Blake creates and we readers find ourselves with the paradoxes sometimes. -R.H. Albright ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 20:41:19 +0000 From: Tom Gilboy To: blake@albion.com Subject: RE: Preferably Chewproof Message-Id: <31AE07EF.A2A@netone.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Many thanks, Ralph, Paul. I've just returned from The Tattered Cover in Denver where, oddly, I found A VISIT TO WILLIAM BLAKE'S INN; I wanted to like it but just couldn't. What the hell I'll just buy him MARRIAGE OF HEAVEN AND HELL and hide it in the bottom of my sweater drawer so he'll sneak it when he's 9. Tom Gilboy "Read Blake or go to hell." --- Northrop Frye, CBC Interview ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 11:59:31 +0200 From: P Van Schaik To: blake@albion.com, jmichael@seraph1.sewanee.edu Subject: "The Voice of the Ancient Bard" -Reply Message-Id: Dear Jennifer, I don't think one has to `like' a poem to place it correctly within the context of Blake's larger vision. I personally get all tangled up iand confused by comments differentiating between Innocnece and Experience with reference only to the Songs. I tend to see a coherence of vision on Blake's part (rather than that some Songs reflect a narrow vision of Innocence, while those in Experience reflect fallen states of the soul, simply) . For me, Blake is always addressing the `Youth of delight' who wish to throw off the restraints of false vision, and giving them courage to do so - to awaken from the `Sleep' of the soul in which (as evoked in Blake's longer poems) Urizen's rational visions triumphed over the divine vision of love which prevailed in the eternal realms of Innocence. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 12:11:04 +0200 From: P Van Schaik To: blake@albion.com, KELEWIS@UNIVSCVM.CSD.SCAROLINA.EDU Subject: Re: discipleship of Blakeans: US vs. UK -Reply/ esp. JESUS Message-Id: While I enjoyed Kenneth Clark's Series very much, I could not agree with the views he expresses in a lecture to one of the British colleges in which he perceives Blake's illstrations of Jesus very conventional. While outwardly these do, indeed, seem much as anyone alse would portray Jesus, I find Blake's interpretation of Jesus in his own poetry very complex and difficult to define. Clearly, he does emphasise Jesus as an exemplar of forgiveness and as coming to earth to heal the `thump' on the head given mankind by His Father. However, looking more deeply, there are many possible comparisons one can make with the figure of Wisdom in Kabbalah (Hokhmah). Just as Jesus is seen as the "Bridegroom" of Jerusalem, so, too, in Kabbalah, can Hokhmah be seen as in holy union with the feminine aspect of God, Binah. This divine marriage is absolutely central to Innocence in Eternity, yet few critics deal with it, and hence, in my opinion, simply do not perceive an entire half of Blake's vision with clarity. If Innocence is not seen clearly, then all that relates to Experience is distorted. Pam van Schaik, Pretoria ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 12:55:20 +0200 From: P Van Schaik To: blake@albion.com, gilboy@netone.com Subject: Preferably chew-proof -Reply Message-Id: Re good children's books - for when they're a little older - You and your child would probably enjoy the "What a Mess" series about a beautiful, princely puppy who inevitably wrecks the house and garden and who is acoompanied by a variety of real and fantastical friends, always doing something very interesting in the accompanying illustrations. As kids tend to get you to repeat ad infinitum any story they like, this series preserves sanity. The illustrations go far beyond simply illustrating the text - they always surprise and delight. Pam van Schaik ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 09:00:51 -0400 From: albright@world.std.com (R.H. Albright) To: blake@albion.com Subject: Jah Wobble and Blake Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Thanks, Morris Eaves, for the description of Jah Wobble's upcoming Blake album. I have particularly enjoyed the album on which Wobble does a collaboration with Sinead O'Connor, and look forward to his interpretation of Blake's works. -R.H. Albright ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 09:10:05 -0400 From: albright@world.std.com (R.H. Albright) To: blake@albion.com Subject: To J. Michaels and All Interested Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Jennifer: First, yes, Blake shifted things around alot in _Songs_. But the final production ends with that "Song" and I believe it remained fairly stable for years. Wrong? Then back to this question, which I'm really quite sick of, Was Blake Mad? My point, Jennifer, just like the bisexual point, was the same as yours: SO WHAT? The reason why I brought it up, is hey, we're supposed to live 200 years in the future from Blake. Taboos are supposed to be somewhat loosenned up. What I've found from this group is NO. And I disagree. Because, like my post on child-like versus childishness, if we admit that he was AT LEAST wildly eccentric and sexually exploratory, it helps our understanding of his art, and we can go on with an "experienced" if "child-like" approach to his art. Otherwise, we're hiding out, and the rest of the world has caught up to us by now, I fear. Just look at DEAD MAN, if it ever comes to Tennessee. But the question should come back to: DO YOU LIKE HIS ART? And I wholeheartedly agree: Very few people in the history of the planet who are different (in MANY ways) have been able to produce art as great as Blake's. >Most people here probably resist the charge of >madness against Blake because in the past it was used to dismiss his work. >And Friedlander, in the conclusion you quoted, rejected Blake's ideas as >"wrong" and "sick.">>> Friedlander is referring specifically to Blake's apocalyptic visions, I believe, when we'll be free of this world and these 5 senses. Please read the whole work for context. I won't speak for him. I'll speak for myself when I say that I don't think his visions are "wrong" or "sick" but that they are HIS visions, not universal truths. People that build churches or are "disciples" of William Blake... I'm not one of them. I admire his art. I don't look at the world the way he looked at it, even if I sometimes think of him and agree. > By the way, I can't find the passages you quoted as >being from the conclusion of _Milton_, >>> Unfortunately, in my rush to answer Tom Devine, I was quoting from "A Vision of the Last Judgment". I apologize. It must have been a Freudian slip in my anger at Blake's seemingly repetitive demands to undermine the 5 senses and our corporal beings. Jennifer did find this from Milton, and it justifies much of what I was feeling, anyway: >To cast aside from Poetry, all that is not Inspiration >That it no longer shall dare to mock with the aspersion of Madness >Cast on the Inspired, by the tame high finisher of paltry Blots, >Indefinite, or paltry Rhymes, or paltry Harmonies. > (41.7-10) This is another dense quote, Jennifer. 1) "All that is not Inspiration..." is that when the angels come and visit him, Emily Dickinson gets her head cut off, and other people speak in tongues? Inspiration can be merely an ecstacy that, when you come down from it, you realize was just intoxication. 2) Is Blake, like all his defenders, saying that the slander of madness ruins the claim to beauty in his art? It's a fine line between inspiration and madness, and I'd say it's his paranoia, justly informed by others's Taboos about what madness is and isn't, that makes him say this. It's also why gay and bisexual people hid in the closet in the Western world ever since Christianity's iron curtain came down over the late Roman Empire, or Marxist regimes, or Nazi regimes... or so many others, too. It seems like artists and gays are always the first to go, when authoritarianism cracks down. So, while I understand his need to protect himself against "slander", since it's not a stigma for me to say he was a different sort of fellow than, say, Wordsworth, it's NOT a slander to me. In fact, it's HELPFUL to me, to see that the man had jump-shifts in his psyche as well as in his art and it's not all MY fault as an "idiot" reader that he was an "inspired", intoxicated poet of visions. 3) This indignant talk of "paltry" in the last lines reminds me of Nietzsche. Blake had a very arrogant side to him, which is... what it is. You have to accept the whole man. It certainly wasn't Jesus Christ, let's put it that way. 4) Looking further at that quote from Milton, you see again an example of Blake's arrogance: "To cast off the idiot Questioner who is always questioning But never capable of answering, who sits with a sly grin Silent plotting when to question, like a thief in a cave; Who publishes doubt & calls it knowledge, whose Science is Despair, Whose pretence to knowledge is Envy, whose whole Science is To destroy the wisdom of ages to gratify ravenous Envy..." Once again there are alot of things going on here. Blake blurs them to fuse an "enemy", but I'm going to try to untangle them. You might say Nietzsche was an "idiot Questioner". I sometimes think he wouldn't have ended up in that mental hospital the last years of his life if he hadn't THOUGHT so much. But... who is the idiot Questioner here? Someone never capable of answering? So should he stop trying? Someone who publishes doubt, like perhaps the good Godwin, who at least gave Blake a publishing outlet? What is wrong with DOUBT, in and of itself? It IS a knowledge. Skepticism is a great deal of what constitutes modern thinking. You don't like what I say, so challenge it! DON'T accept things at face value. But Blake only paints this outlook here as BAD. Science is despair? Again, he's thrown out a big, broad blanket. Science and "pretence to knowledge" can also produce a welfare state/blanket as Thomas Paine predicted, and which now exists in every major industrial country, just as well as the merely selfish Victorian capitalists that Dickens painted so well. There's many more questions to be asked in these passages... but I'm trying to keep this short. "To destroy the wisdom of ages..." is another key to Blake and his desire to get back to the simpler, non-industrial, mystical England that simply will never exist again. Thomas Jefferson didn't throw away the Bible. Neither did Emerson. But they were looking for something MORE. And unlike Blake, they drew upon the Greco-Roman world far more... possibly the Hindu-Buddhist world, as you can see in Voltaire's _Philosophical Dictionary_. What I see hear, Jennifer, is a beautiful poetic tirade. Complicated, beautiful, but a tirade nonetheless. But keep trying to convince me that they're worth it! Point me toward other passages, and I'll give them a whirl! -R.H. Albright ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 May 96 09:21:00 EDT From: "Fabian, Matthew" To: BlakeListserv Subject: Re: Blake "sight" Message-Id: <31AEF434@smtpgate1.moodys.com> Once again, from the latest Daedalus Books catalog: VINDICATION by Frances Sherwood (1993, 435 pages, $4.98) "VINDICATION is a whirlwind of a novel that offers a passionate and surprising vision through the lens of the turbulent, romantic, often brutal 18th century. It is the story of a gifted, restless young woman who leaves her uncompromising family to make her way in the world, first as a governess and later as a writer. She journeys to London, where she is taken in by her publisher and becomes involved with many of the great figures of the day: William Blake, William Godwin, and the artist Henry Fuseli. She has a series of unhappy loves, including a disastrous affair in Paris during the French Revolution with a dashing American businessman, attempts suicide, and spends time in Bedlam. The novel is loosely based on the life of Mary Wollstonecraft, the 18th-century feminist writer, but she invests Wollstonecraft's story with a modern, very self-aware urgency." Let's hope the author didn't write this grammatical mess. -Matt Fabian ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 09:45:39 -0400 (EDT) From: Nelson Hilton To: blake@albion.com Subject: Re: "The Voice of the Ancient Bard" Message-Id: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Thu, 30 May 1996, J. Michael wrote: > the sequence is impossible to establish Well, there's no *one* sequence, but the various ones Blake offered have been pretty thoroughly established. They can all be tried out beginning at: http://virtual.park.uga.edu/~wblake/SIE/begin/begin1.html ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 11:18:26 -0400 From: albright@world.std.com (R.H. Albright) To: blake@albion.com Subject: Tainted Visions on Friedlander Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I have received some public and private posts warning me that bringing Friedlander's thesis into this discussion is not appropriate. Why not? He published it on the Net, so he must want people to be heard. Also, I think people neglect that Friedlander originally wrote the thesis as part of an honors degree in ENGLISH, not psychology. He only later updated the thesis after he had been through medical school. If you can't tell, through his writing, that he loves Blake, and did well as an English scholar... try to stain the waters clear, folks. THEN tell me how wrong he is! I graduated with honors from the same department 5 years later. In one of the core courses to fulfill my major, which at that time was called "Semiotics", readings included: Gregory Bateson's _Steps Toward an Ecology of Mind_ R.D. Laing's _Knots_ Levi-Strauss's _Structural Anthropology_ Umberto Eco's _A Theory of Semiotics_ Roland Barthes's _Mythologies_ These readings were meant to create connections between English, pyschology, and anthropology, tried to forge a better understanding of semantics, as well as tried to better understand what was really happening in the complexity which we can summarize as an author/reader relationship. They did not undermine connections to departments with which English had traditionally close links, such as history and art. I think it's a sign that the department made some good choices that _Knots_ and _Steps Toward an Ecology of Mind_ are still coming up for some people as they think about Blake today. (I graduated almost 20 years ago.) "Expect poison from the standing water." ---William Blake, "The Marriage of Heaven and Hell", Plate 8 -R.H. Albright ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 11:18:57 -0500 From: tomdill@womenscol.stephens.edu To: blake@albion.com Subject: Re: Blake "sight" Message-Id: <96053111185710@womenscol.stephens.edu> As for _Vindication_, I would suggest that the author would have been lucky to come up to the level of the Daedalus blurb. I won't bore the list with a review, but I do encourage you not to waste your money on this wretched production. Tom Dillingham ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 10:25:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Ralph Dumain To: blake@albion.com Subject: RADICAL EXPRESSION -- QUERY Message-Id: <199605311725.KAA19426@igc2.igc.apc.org> Yesterday I spotted a used copy of RADICAL EXPRESSION by James A. Epstein for $12. This has to do with political opposition in Britain in Blake's time. There are only two passing references to Blake. Did someone mention this book recently in connection with Jon Mee? Do you think I need this book, too? ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 11:03:29 -0700 From: Steven Marx To: blake@albion.com Subject: [Fwd: The grave of William Blake] Message-Id: <31AF3471.A89@oboe.calpoly.edu> Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mailbox2.calpoly.edu by oboe.aix.calpoly.edu (AIX 3.2/UCB 5.64/4.03) id AA65403; Fri, 31 May 1996 07:58:03 -0700 Received: by mailbox.calpoly.edu (AIX 3.2/UCB 5.64/4.03) id AA13246; Fri, 31 May 1996 07:57:58 -0700 Received: from m1.cs.man.ac.uk by mailbox.calpoly.edu (AIX 3.2/UCB 5.64/4.03) id AA22202; Fri, 31 May 1996 07:57:55 -0700 Received: from n6j (n6j.cs.man.ac.uk) by m1.cs.man.ac.uk (4.1/SMI-4.1:AL6) id AA22932; Fri, 31 May 96 15:57:35 BST Sender: rosenben@cs.man.ac.uk Message-Id: <31AF08DA.167EB0E7@cs.man.ac.uk> Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 15:57:31 +0100 X-Ph: V4.4@mailbox.calpoly.edu From: Mr Neil Organization: World Explorer X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0b3 (X11; I; SunOS 4.1.2 sun4c) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: smarx@calpoly.edu Subject: The grave of William Blake Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mozilla-Status: 0001 -- Please help me. I am looking for the grave of William Blake in the hope of making a rubbing. Do you have any idea where his grave lies? ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 14:23:57 -0400 From: cxh36@psu.edu (Chad Hayton) To: blake@albion.com, blake@albion.com Subject: Re: Tainted Visions on Friedlander Message-Id: <199605311823.OAA38010@r05n01.cac.psu.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 11:18 AM 5/31/96 -0400, blake@albion.com wrote: >I have received some public and private posts warning me that bringing >Friedlander's thesis into this discussion is not appropriate. Why not? He >published it on the Net, so he must want people to be heard. > >Also, I think people neglect that Friedlander originally wrote the thesis >as part of an honors degree in ENGLISH, not psychology. He only later >updated the thesis after he had been through medical school. R.H., Actually, I think the point is not that you shouldn't use Friedlander as support for your arguements, but that your argument is less convincing when you use Friedlander as your _sole_ support. What have some other critics said? I personally don't believe that Blake was mad (whatever that means) and find your argument easier to dismiss when it seems that your and Friedlander's position hovers on the fring of Blake scholarship. Essentially, we are saying that simply because Friedlander was a English major does not make him an authority on Blake. To quote Hamlet: "I'll have grounds more relative than this." Sincerely, Chad Hayton Pennsylvania State University ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 15:16:33 -0400 (EDT) From: "Michelle L. Gompf" To: BlakeListserv Subject: Re: Blake "sight" Message-Id: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII I have to agree with Tom...._Vindication_ is, at best, beach reading. The kind of book you don't mind getting salt water and sand all over. Michelle ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 14:35:10 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew J Dubuque To: blake@albion.com Subject: Re: Muddle & Puzzle Message-Id: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII To all: please note bateson in his introduction to steps to an ecology of mind also described blake as the man who knew more about what it was to be human than anyone else.... matthew dubuque virtual@leland.stanford.edu On Thu, 30 May 1996, R.H. Albright wrote: > >For a fine understanding of muddle and Blake, see Gregory Bateson's _Ecology > >of Mind_. There is a chapter on Why Are Things Muddled and then a later > >chapter called Why Do Things Have Outlines which links the muddle problem with > >Blake and his stance(s) on clear bounding lines. > > Thank you, Ron. A very good tip, indeed. Outside of official Blake > scholarship, yet referring to Blake. Bateson is also the one who talks > about "double binds" which Blake creates and we readers find ourselves > with the paradoxes sometimes. > > -R.H. Albright > > > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 17:17:47 -0500 From: enghhh@showme.missouri.edu (Howard Hinkel) To: blake@albion.com Subject: retrospective blake sighting Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" It's been years since I read Colin Wilson's "Glass Cage," and I can't find my copy now, so this may be a limp version of Wordsworthian creative memory at work, but I think I recall that a retired Blake scholar was brought in to help track down a culprit guilty of particularly gruesome murders marked by dismemberment and noteworthy because the murderer left behind Blake quotations, including such passages as this from the B of U: "He threw his right Arm to the north, / His left Arm to the south." Alas. I'm pretty sure the murderer was not the Blake scholar! "Urizen" hasn't had much time on the list lately. Might there be discussion space for that work somewhere between the active and thoughtful interest of some in Songs and the invitation of some others to plunge into "Milton" and "Jerusalem"? The Lambeth books generally? Maybe something of a common ground? ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 22:26:40 -0400 (EDT) From: "Avery F. Gaskins" To: Subject: Questioning Idiots Message-Id: I think that Blake's best model for "questioning idiots" has to be the Saducees and Pharisees (sp?) who continually questioned Jesus in ways that they hoped would get him to say something heretical. They were absolutely certain of the rightousness of their position after using what Blake would see as Urizenic reasoning, and were not open to any imaginative new messages. Their counter- parts in Blake's time would have been all those groups mired in dogma and to whom he addressed a number of rebukes. (Aside to Seth, I can never remember if I send messages to Blake-request or just to Blake. If it comes to you directly, will you please forward to the list? Thanks) Avery Gaskins ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Jun 96 15:43:10 -0700 From: Seth T. Ross To: blake@albion.com Subject: Re: Questioning Idiots Message-Id: <9606032243.AA00612@albion.com> Content-Type: text/plain Avery F. Gaskins" queries: > Aside to Seth, I can never remember if I send messages to > Blake-request or just to Blake. If it comes to you directly, > will you please forward to the list? Messages go to blake@albion.com. Administrative queries go to blake-request@albion.com. For example, to leave the list, send mail to blake-request@albion.com with the word "unsubscribe" as the SUBJECT of the message. It's not my usual practice to forward blake-request messages to the list unless it's obvious that's what the author wants me to do. BTW, the list was down over the weekend due to technical difficulties. We're fine now, running better than ever. Cheers, Seth List-maintainer -------------------------------- End of blake-d Digest V1996 Issue #62 *************************************