------------------------------ Content-Type: text/plain blake-d Digest Volume 1996 : Issue 1 Today's Topics: Blake citing on Jeopardy Re: Collected/Selected Blake's Re: Blake citing on Jeopardy Blake texts Re: Blake citing on Jeopardy Re: Blake texts Re: Blake citing on Jeopardy Blake texts Re: Blake citing on Jeopardy Re: Blake texts Re: Blake texts Theatrical Pieces based on the work of Blake Re: Blake texts Re: Blake texts Dover facsimiles Brief introduction introduction Re: Brief introduction Re: introduction Re: Brief introduction ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 05 Jan 96 16:56:21 CST From: Mark Trevor Smith To: blake@albion.com Subject: Blake citing on Jeopardy Message-Id: <9601052305.AA11726@uu6.psi.com> Today on Jeopardy, the very last answer--in the category Poetry for 1000--was "His Introduction to Songs of Innocence begins 'Piping down the valleys wild.'" The contestants stood in dumb contemplation until Alex Trebek revealed the correct question. Lest you think that they were particularly ignorant of our hero, they also failed to pronounce the title of the poem that begins (after they were told T.S. Eliot) "Let us go then you and I when the evening is spread out against the sky," although one did hazard the guess, "What is The Wasteland"? ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 05 Jan 1996 12:50:50 -0800 From: strider%toybox@agora.rdrop.com (Jean Mittelstaedt) To: blake@albion.com Subject: Re: Collected/Selected Blake's Message-Id: <199601052203.OAA06327@toybox> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Just sitting at my desk, drawing up a syllabus, reading half-way through >Alfred Kazin's Intro to his _Portable Blake_, and skimming the rest. > >Wondering if anyone on the list who teaches Blake has used the Kazin text. I haven't taught Blake, but I just finished a Romanticism class where I used this text and found it very helpful. I did wish that some more of the prophetic books had been included, but I had access to them elsewhere, so I wasn't that upset. I also found the introduction interesting. All in all, a good undergrad edition--fairly complete, good price. That's what I looked for then! Hope this helps1 Cheers, Jean Mittelstaedt strider%toybox@agora.rdrop.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Jan 1996 18:47:54 +0000 (GMT) From: Marcus Smith To: blake@albion.com Cc: blake@albion.com Subject: Re: Blake citing on Jeopardy Message-Id: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Fri, 5 Jan 1996, Mark Trevor Smith wrote: > Today on Jeopardy, the very last answer--in the category Poetry for > 1000--was "His Introduction to Songs of Innocence begins 'Piping down > the valleys wild.'" The contestants stood in dumb contemplation until > Alex Trebek revealed the correct question. Lest you think that they > were particularly ignorant of our hero, they also failed to pronounce > the title of the poem that begins (after they were told T.S. Eliot) > "Let us go then you and I when the evening is spread out against the > sky," although one did hazard the guess, "What is The Wasteland"? > > I'm not sure what Mark Smith wants us to make out of these misses on today's Jeopardy. Should we be dismayed? Outraged? Or smug that we "got" these lightweight trivia? I personally don't think it means anything at all. The contestants did, by the way, correctly identify Pavlov as having received the Nobel Prize for medicine in 1904--a much more exotic datum in my book. Does Blake cast any light on the question of informational hierarchies? Would he understand the distinctions between static, information, knowledge, power? Relatively yours, Marcus Smith ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Jan 1996 18:36:24 -0600 From: tomdill@womenscol.stephens.edu To: BLAKE@albion.com Subject: Blake texts Message-Id: <96010518362488@womenscol.stephens.edu> Having been unsubscribed several weeks ago because our server was malfunctioning, I have missed much of the recent dialogue and apologize if I am repeating or just being redundant. I will be using the Erdman/Bloom volume for my Blake course this coming semester as I have done regularly since it was published in paperback. (Actually, I once used the hardback in an earlier edition when it was not available in pb.) While I admit the price is steep (though not nearly as high as the M.Y. Hughes edition of Milton, whihc I have finally had to give up and replace with Shawcross in pb), I have always argued that English majors ought to be buying books with an eye to building their permanent libraries and that $30 or $40 for a good lasting edition was in the way of an investment. I think we could all benefit from looking at the prices on the computer science, accounting, and psychology texts they buy (almost nothing under $70) before we feel guilty about our books. AT the same time, I am really indignant about the ridiculously inflated prices of some texts (almost everything from Norton, for example), and particularly incensed over the Hughes volume I just mentioned. That book has been through many printings since 1957 but has not been re-edited and so cannot be costing the publisher anything but the reprinting costs. I bought my first copy as an undergraduate in 1960 and I am sure it was less than $20 then (of course that is about $70 in today's dollars, so maybe my complaint is not entirely accurate); anyway, I feel they are ripping off the public an d certainly they have discouraged even my choice of that book, though my argument about adding a good book to one's library used to apply to that as well. I understand Jennifer's comment about Bloom's having passed over the songs in his commentary, but I normally discourage students from looking at any of his commentary until they have sampled other critics on reserve--no disrespect to Bloom, but he is not my first choice as an introductory critic. But I really do think the Erdman text is the right one to be reading, especially if the student intends to keep the book. Once I used the Oxford Keynes, but I was bothered myself by the freely edited text and went right back to Erdman (by freely edited, I only mean regularized spelling and punctuation). Since I am on here and enjoying being back on the list, I might add (at the risk of repeating) a note I tried to send the other day but that may not have been posted since I was not subscribed. In last Sunday's NY TIMES Book Review, a novel called _Nobodaddy's Children_, by Arno Schmidt, was given an enthusiastic review. But the reviewer did not mention Blake and did not explain the title. Has anyone read the novel? Does anyone know if Schmidt really was alluding to Blake? He sounds like a very good writer, if the reviewer can be trusted. (The publisher is Dalkey ARchive.) Also--one more question. Has anyone read Colin Wilson's _The Glass Cage_? It is a murder/occult story and the quest for the killer turns on quotations from Blake. I'm just curious about others' reactions to it. Tom Dillingham (tomdill@womenscol.stephens.edu) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 Jan 96 00:55:18 CST From: Mark Trevor Smith To: blake@albion.com Subject: Re: Blake citing on Jeopardy Message-Id: <9601060704.AA03237@uu6.psi.com> My near namesake wonders what I wanted us to make of ignorance of poetry on Jeopardy. I wanted to point out that Blake was one of the questions, and I wanted to point out that the contestants did not know the answer. Yes, they did know Pavlov, with which I was impressed also, since I did not know Pavlov. I have no idea what Marcus Smith meant by his final paragraph below. Yes, I do think it a shame that poetry is slighted in our educational system, and yes I do think that omission more of a shame than my ignorance of scientific facts. And yes, I do think that there is no better or worthwhile understanding than that derived from reading Blake's poetry. For example, I was moved and impressed by Dumain's recent account of reading thru all of Blake in late November to commemorate the birthday. I apologize for any hint of smugness in my original note. > >On Fri, 5 Jan 1996, Mark Trevor Smith wrote: > >> Today on Jeopardy, the very last answer--in the category Poetry for >> 1000--was "His Introduction to Songs of Innocence begins 'Piping down >> the valleys wild.'" The contestants stood in dumb contemplation until >> Alex Trebek revealed the correct question. Lest you think that they >> were particularly ignorant of our hero, they also failed to pronounce >> the title of the poem that begins (after they were told T.S. Eliot) >> "Let us go then you and I when the evening is spread out against the >> sky," although one did hazard the guess, "What is The Wasteland"? >> >> >I'm not sure what Mark Smith wants us to make out of these misses on >today's Jeopardy. Should we be dismayed? Outraged? Or smug that we >"got" these lightweight trivia? I personally don't think it means >anything at all. The contestants did, by the way, correctly identify >Pavlov as having received the Nobel Prize for medicine in 1904--a much >more exotic datum in my book. > >Does Blake cast any light on the question of informational hierarchies? >Would he understand the distinctions between static, information, >knowledge, power? > >Relatively yours, > >Marcus Smith > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Jan 1996 04:45:03 -0800 From: The Cruising Chaos To: blake@albion.com Subject: Re: Blake texts Message-Id: <199601061245.EAA18564@north.pacificnet.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 06:36 PM 1/5/96 -0600, you wrote: >Also--one more question. Has anyone read Colin Wilson's _The Glass >Cage_? It is a murder/occult story and the quest for the killer >turns on quotations from Blake. I'm just curious about others' >reactions to it. Tom Dillingham (tomdill@womenscol.stephens.edu) I read it about 3 months ago, it wasn't particularly brilliant for Wilson - he's done a lot better. It wasn't particularly Blake-influenced, just the quotes and the probing of the killer's mind. Shemhazai ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jan 1996 05:05:40 -0500 From: CaroleM250@aol.com To: blake@albion.com Subject: Re: Blake citing on Jeopardy Message-Id: <960107050539_108810362@mail04.mail.aol.com> Marcus Smith: In a message dated 96-01-05 21:30:18 EST, you write: >> >I'm not sure what Mark Smith wants us to make out of these misses on >today's Jeopardy. Should we be dismayed? Outraged? Or smug that we >"got" these lightweight trivia? I personally don't think it means >anything at all. Mark Trevor Smith has been "collecting" Blake citings for quite some time now (as a matter of personal interest, I presume) and routinely passes these onto the list members -- in case we are interested. Those members who are not interested can delete it and those who are, can read it. Either way, my guess is that Mark wasn't trying to make any kind of "statement," other than passing along interesting information. Carole Moran ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Jan 96 19:26:10 CST From: Mark Trevor Smith To: blake@albion.com Subject: Blake texts Message-Id: <9601080135.AA25275@uu6.psi.com> I agree strongly with Tom Dillingham's recent post recommending the Erdman edition. I'm sorry that I deleted it instead of repeating it here, but perhaps people remember it well enough. Essentially he said that he encourages undergraduates to start building libraries of the best editions. Even before I studied with Erdman, I thought that his edition was by far the best, and I am very puzzled when people prefer regularized spelling and punctuation. Aren't we already losing enough when we transfer the illuminated works to the printed page? Why lose even more by false and often misleading punctuation? Especially in the days of rampant "sic," when every jot and tittle from the writer's hand is considered sacrosanct, why would we want to "improve" in the high=handed style of editors of old? I foresee a day when we can use facsimiles of the illuminated works in the classroom. The Illuminated Blake was a giant step in the right direction. In fact, has anyone used the new Princeton reproductions for teaching? I mean, require the students to buy one of them? Too expensive, so only on reserve? I'll be teaching a Blake seminar to M.A. candidates in fall '96 and am toying with the idea of centering the course around the reproduction of Jerusalem. Would it cost them about $70? -- Mark ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Jan 96 19:22:02 CST From: Mark Trevor Smith To: blake@albion.com Subject: Re: Blake citing on Jeopardy Message-Id: <9601080127.AA24314@uu6.psi.com> Thank you, Carole. You said exactly what I should have said in response, but unfortunately a tone of smugness did creep in. It is not just "personal interest" that prompted my suggestion that we on the list inform each other of Blake citings. Don't all of us on the list find trivial mentions of Blake in everyday life worth noting? -- Mark On Sun, 7 Jan 1996 05:05:40 -0500 said: >Marcus Smith: >In a message dated 96-01-05 21:30:18 EST, you write: > >>> >>I'm not sure what Mark Smith wants us to make out of these misses on >>today's Jeopardy. Should we be dismayed? Outraged? Or smug that we >>"got" these lightweight trivia? I personally don't think it means >>anything at all. > >Mark Trevor Smith has been "collecting" Blake citings for quite some time now >(as a matter of personal interest, I presume) and routinely passes these onto >the list members -- in case we are interested. Those members who are not >interested can delete it and those who are, can read it. Either way, my >guess is that Mark wasn't trying to make any kind of "statement," other than >passing along interesting information. > >Carole Moran > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jan 1996 21:05:36 -0600 From: tomdill@womenscol.stephens.edu To: blake@albion.com Subject: Re: Blake texts Message-Id: <96010721053613@womenscol.stephens.edu> I believe that the Princeton edition of the _Songs_ is now available in paperback. I have no idea when the rest would also be, but the prices seem to be in the $20 to$30 range and that is definitely not too steep. IN the meantime, the Dover press reproductions of the Songs, of America and Europe, and of Marriage of Heaven and Hell are definitely cheap enough to include in a course, and Illuminated Blake is also available from Dover at about $20, so I am having our store stock that as an optional text. The Dover books may not be ideal, are certainly not as good as the Princeton series, but they serve as a constant reminder to the student that Blake is a graphic artist/poet/prophet. Even with the legitimate complaints about the bad coloring of the Dover group, I guess I think they are better than nothing. (Though I know of some purists who consider them worse than nothing.) Tom Dillingham ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jan 1996 12:07:54 -0800 From: Devine/Apple@eworld.com To: blake@albion.com Subject: Re: Blake texts Message-Id: <960108120702_21950540@hp1.online.apple.com> When I bought the Princeton Jerusalem about two years ago, I think it was $75, and it was well worth it -- a revelation! The reproduction is certainly the best I have seen, and it makes it possible to feel the power of the illustrations much more fully than I had expected. Are the Oxford reproductions of Marriage of Heaven and Hell and Songs of Inn & Exp out of print? Those were certainly superior to the Dover editions as I recall. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jan 96 12:52:27 -0800 From: Seth T. Ross To: blake@albion.com Cc: AnticArts@aol.com Subject: Theatrical Pieces based on the work of Blake Message-Id: <9601082052.AA00554@albion.com> Content-Type: text/plain Blakeans: I'm forwarding this from Greg Morell. --Seth Ross http://www.bookfair.com/Publishers/1887164/listBlake.html Name: Greg Morell E-Mail: AnticArts@aol.com Physical address: 105 Marion St., Northampton, MA 01060 Phone: 413-586-7999 Interested in creating Theatrical Pieces based on the work of Blake and an Educational Bio Piece for Touring Interested participants should contact me phone or e-mail. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jan 1996 15:09:48 -0600 From: tomdill@womenscol.stephens.edu To: blake@albion.com Subject: Re: Blake texts Message-Id: <96010815094807@womenscol.stephens.edu> The Oxford _Songs_ and _Marriage_ are still available and are undoubtedly superior to the Dover editions--they are also not very much more expensive--about $13 and $14 respectively. I should have remembered to menton them. Tom Dillingham ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jan 1996 16:00:09 -0600 From: "Jeffrey Skoblow" To: blake@albion.com Subject: Re: Blake texts Message-Id: <9601082158.AA29141@daisy.ac.siue.edu> > Date: Mon, 8 Jan 1996 12:07:54 -0800 > From: Devine/Apple@eworld.com > To: blake@albion.com > Subject: Re: Blake texts > Reply-to: blake@albion.com The Oxford Songs and Marriage are both still in print-- I taught from them this past semester-- although the reproductions are less vivid than in the earlier printings. --Jeffrey Skoblow > When I bought the Princeton Jerusalem about two years ago, I think it was > $75, and it was well worth it -- a revelation! The reproduction is certainly > the best I have seen, and it makes it possible to feel the power of the > illustrations much more fully than I had expected. > > Are the Oxford reproductions of Marriage of Heaven and Hell and Songs of Inn > & Exp out of print? Those were certainly superior to the Dover editions as I > recall. > > > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jan 1996 17:11:30 -0600 From: jmichael@seraph1.sewanee.edu (jennifer michael) To: blake@albion.com Subject: Dover facsimiles Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I'd like to add a plug for the Dover edition of America and Europe (published together for around $7 US), which I had my students buy last semester and use in writing their final paper. I felt strongly that each student should have a personal copy of the complete text with designs, rather than using reserve copies, and Dover made this feasible. There were no complaints about having to buy the text, and the papers I got were, on the whole, far above my expectations. Jennifer Michael ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jan 1996 02:03:50 +0000 (GMT) From: Mae Tang To: blake@albion.com Cc: Mae Tang Subject: Brief introduction Message-Id: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII I'm new to this list, and so thought that I'd introduce myself briefly. I'm a second year undergraduate at the University of York, reading English and related literatures, and I'm just about to start a term covering the Romantics--- which I'm looking forward to quite a lot. From the initial reading that I've done of Blake so far, I find myself increasingly intrigued by his ideas, hence my subscription to this list. Have to admit that I was stuck for about an hour in a bookshop trying to decide which edition of Blake to get, and finally decided on the Longman version; wish I'd read the discussion on texts before then! Regards, Mae Tang ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jan 1996 16:51:34 +0800 (SST) From: LIM WEE CHING To: blake@albion.com Subject: introduction Message-Id: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Greetings one and all, My name is CHING and I'm serving compulsary militray service in Singapore. I'm also doing the first of a 2 years' foundation course -- for my BA Eng (external) from University of London -- part time. Blake's _Songs_ is part of UOL's prescribed 'canon' and the public libraries here in Singapore are absolutely hopeless when it comes to reference books etc. So here I am! attempting to draw on everybody's expertise in Blake. I've read _Songs_ and enjoyed it very much -- now to get down to studying it in depth!! CHEERS!! Ching ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jan 96 12:04:06 CST From: Mark Trevor Smith To: blake@albion.com Subject: Re: Brief introduction Message-Id: <9601092053.AA22511@uu6.psi.com> On Tue, 9 Jan 1996 02:03:50 +0000 (GMT) Mae Tang said: If your Longman is the same as mine, then the annotations are by William Stevenson; they are excellent. Unfortunately the text is regularized in spelling and punctuation, forced against Stevenson's will. -- MTS > >Have to admit that I was stuck for about an hour in a bookshop trying to >decide which edition of Blake to get, and finally decided on the Longman >version; wish I'd read the discussion on texts before then! > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jan 1996 16:09:44 -0600 From: tomdill@womenscol.stephens.edu To: blake@albion.com Subject: Re: introduction Message-Id: <96010916094466@womenscol.stephens.edu> Greetings Ching! Could you give us an idea of how we could help. Your message implies you have no access to critical studies or reference works at your libraries--is that a total vacuum or do you have a few choices? Or do you need advice on titles from which to choose? Or specific answers about the Songs? I am sure many on the list could help. By the way, what edition of Blake's poems are you using--or are you reading the Songs in a collection or anthology? That would help us with thinking about what you need for support. Tom Dillingham ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jan 1996 22:30:46 -0600 From: tomdill@womenscol.stephens.edu To: blake@albion.com Subject: Re: Brief introduction Message-Id: <96010922304604@womenscol.stephens.edu> This may sound excessive, but a good case can be made--if you are planning to do extensive work on Blake--for having both Stevenson and Erdman handy. They are different enough from each other, offering complementary strengths, that no serious scholar would be sorry to have both books. Tom Dillingham -------------------------------- End of blake-d Digest V1996 Issue #1 ************************************